FORUMula1.com - F1 Forum

[Hammer278]

I read somewhere that an entire season of F1's fuel consumption today is still less compared to a Boeing aircrafts consumption in a 1 way trip halfway around the globe. True?

[smokin]

I read somewhere that an entire season of F1's fuel consumption today is still less compared to a Boeing aircrafts consumption in a 1 way trip halfway around the globe. True?

It may well be but you need to take the fuel consumption per person into account.

[MattMK45]

I read somewhere that an entire season of F1's fuel consumption today is still less compared to a Boeing aircrafts consumption in a 1 way trip halfway around the globe. True?

Top Gear magazine from a few years ago. I'll have to check my archive to see which issue.

[McHare]

The mpg is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things but if you have a fuel flow limit then how you burn the fuel becomes all important. Hence, the most efficient combustion technology wins the tech race an this would undoubtedly reap production car spin offs we all could benefit from. New engine technologies such as HCCI or interesting configuration concepts like the economotor being developed for the aircraft industry would come on leaps and bounds.

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

Boeing claim the 747 burns 5 gallons per mile (presumably US gallons per statute mile in cruise flight), 0.2 mpg. F1 cars get about 3.8 mpg Imperial, 3.1 mpg US, 75L/100km.

The mpg is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things but if you have a fuel flow limit then how you burn the fuel becomes all important. Hence, the most efficient combustion technology wins the tech race an this would undoubtedly reap production car spin offs we all could benefit from....

It worked out that way during the most recent turbocharging era. Refueling was banned for portions of it, too, and maximum fuel tank size was restricted by the TR. It was quite common that the race engineer would order the driver to turn down the turbo's boost, otherwise he wouldn't make the finish. Plus they had liquid-cooled brakes, and the winner often would pull over and stop immediately after crossing the finish to assure he'd make minimum spec weight.

That's why fuel is temperature regulated/tested now, because some rocket scientist determined they could stuff an extra litre or two into the tank if the petrol was chilled to within a degree or two of the temp at which it would gel (plus the chilled fuel gave a denser intake charge, which means more BHPs). If the cars sat on the start grid more than the briefest minute, the petrol would begin to warm and expand and overflow onto the circuit.

[McHare]

Remember those great days very well indeed. Of course there were calc errors most notably McLaren ran dry with Senna on board on more than one occasion. But that surely is where we want to be. Driving forward technology. Bring it back I say

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

... That's a pretty engine....

Glad you like it. As Enzo once said to Paul Frere, "A Ferrari is a 12-cylinder auto." And who am I to argue with Il Commendatore?



Rear view:


120° V-6. HUGE impellers for a 750cc bank of cylinders.


And if Ferrari complain about development of a turbo I-4 ...



... it's not like they'd be breaking unrtodden ground.

[Mr.Conte]

I myself do not care for inline 4s turbo'd or other wise.
At least a V6 as most cars today have V6s as standard.
I believe Ferrari already has a turbo V6 fully developed and waiting.
800 HP is not out of the question for a V6 turbo.
The real nice thing is the return of ground effects..
THAT will make for more dicing between drivers.

[What's Burning?]

Fred where did you get these pictures from, they're really good did you have the good fortune to take them yourself in a Ferrari factory tour?

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

Fred where did you get these pictures from, they're really good did you have the good fortune to take them yourself in a Ferrari factory tour?

They're from the Museo Galleria Ferrari in Maranello, a couple of blocks removed from the factory. I couldn't get a factory tour, but it wasn't for lack of trying. You have to be a VIP, a member of the press or a member of the Ferrari Owner's Club (which, naturally, requires that you own a Ferrari) and I was SOL on all counts. Merely standing at the fence and drooling currys no favor with that lot.

EDIT:
The 4-pot was inside a small, slightly hazy perspex box, which prevented taking decent pictures.

...800 HP is not out of the question for a V6 turbo....

With forced induction, the number of cylinders have very little to do with the BHP attainable.

[f1ea]

Great pics Fred!!

Yes, the I4 turbo its not uncharted territory... but its more that the V6 is simply beautiful.

Mr.Conte wrote:
...800 HP is not out of the question for a V6 turbo....
With forced induction, the number of cylinders have very little to do with the BHP attainable.

I think it would come down to revs and boost pressure mostly. Which would both determine engine life.... so that's why i think if they are so aiming for longevity..... why not go with a V6 TT??
its a sight to see, should have a longer life, an angrier sound, and you dont find them in the Hondas and Subarus... which i'm sure its who the big manufacturers want to distance their cars from hehe

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

...I think it would come down to revs and boost pressure mostly....

Mostly boost. The limit with NA engines is more determined by how much fuel/air mix they can suck in per rev, and how frequently those revs occur, so they tend to favour multi-valve, multi-cylinder designs. FI engines play by a different set of rules, which is why supercharged drag racers prefer the simplicity of 2-V OHV 8,000 RPM V-8s. You don't need lots of valves or RPMs when you're running 4.4 bar/65 psi of boost.

Porsche in particular are able to build FI engines that are as durable as anyone else's NA lumps. Some versions of the 917 ran as much as 2.7 bar/39 psi boost, and then ran at full suck for 24 hours at LeMans. That's more boost than F1 allowed in 1989. Nonetheless, with ~1500 BHP coming from just 5.4 litres, that was one severely stressed engine.

[What's Burning?]

I'll have to put the Museo Galleria Ferrari on my must see list when I make it to Italy.